From My Mind To Your Eyes: Eli Or Peyton: Are We Really Debating This?

"Hey Bro, You hear that I'm better than you are?"

“Always the "lesser" Manning, Eli's quiet ascendancy turns up the volume on the debate over which brother is really better.”

-ESPN’s tease of Rick Reilly’s weekly column on January 20, 2012

For years, Eli Manning has been viewed under a microscope, partly because he is Peyton’s younger brother, but also partly because he was a number one overall draft pick who took the prima donna turn and told the team that drafted him, the San Diego Chargers, that he, under no circumstances, would play for them. For years, he has been viewed as an underachiever who never lived up to the hype. Even after “the luckiest play in the history of the Super Bowl” – you know the play – won him the Lombardi Trophy and the game’s MVP (how does this award remain nameless. Hello Joe Montana Trophy) nobody gave him the credit he deserved. How was he NOT recognized by mainstream media after leading the Giants - or, as I like them called, because it sounds so damn effeminate, the G-Men – to two whole touchdowns, throwing for two-hundred-and-fifty-five impressive yards in the process? The world’s an unfair place, Eli, get your fucking helmet.

Seriously though, Eli Manning wasn’t nearly as poor as some writers would have you believe. But, that’s what happens when you’re the quarterback of the Giants, you get scrutinized. How can you not? Look at the illustrious list of QBs that preceded Eli. There’s Simms and, well, YA Tittle, and, um, Jeff Hostetler? OK, bad example. Still, being the signal caller in New York – or, for the literal folks, New Jersey – and bullying your way onto the team, you’re going to be scrutinized, even if you’re brother isn’t one of the best quarterbacks who snapped on a chinstrap.

Look at what Eli has done in his career:

· First, he has started every game in seven full seasons, covering one-hundred-twelve games, the third longest streak (for a QB) in the HISTORY OF THE N-F-FUCKING-L.

· He has thrown for four-thousand-plus yards in three consecutive seasons, and more than three-thousand in every full year of his career.

· He has never thrown less than twenty touchdowns in a full season and has never thrown more interceptions than touchdowns in a season.

· He has NEVER had a losing season under center, winning sixty-nine games (a hair under ten per year) and boasts a .580 winning percentage.

· He set the NFL record for fourth-quarter touchdown passes in 2011 with fifteen.

He’s had a very nice career, certainly better than what the media reports. He’s played football in January a lot, and has been relatively successful doing it. He’s stopped hearts then defribulated them back. And, he’s never been better than he was this season, and seems to be trending upward. It is no less reasonable to think that he could be donning the mustard yellow coat in Canton than it would be to consider the same for Aaron Rodgers. He certainly will be remembered for his time in the NFL.

But, debating if he is better than Peyton?

Really?

Let me say that again, but with proper emphasis:

FUCKING REALLY????

Rick Reilly, writing his Eli column

Well, Rick Reilly thinks it’s possible. He argues that Eli has a better playoff record (6-3 vs 9-10), that he’s beaten better opponents in the playoffs (Brady and Rodgers), that he has twice the road playoff wins as his big bro (four vs. two), that he threw for more yards this season than Peyton ever did in a single season (4,933 vs. 4,700), and that, as I mentioned before, he threw more fourth quarter touchdown passes than anyone (which includes Peyton). Those are Reilly’s reasons for stating that Eli could have a better career than Peyton. (another reason is that a story like this gets his link clicked more than say one that said, “Eli is an very good QB but Peyton is still better”)

Rick Reilly is insane. (or so desperate to out-click fellow ESPN columnist Bill Simmons, that he’ll stoop to such levels) However, he's not the only pundit to make these outrageous claims. You can find more mind-bogglers on Yahoo Sports and Bleacher Report, among others. Who knew sports writers were mostly insane or desperate? (Answer: I did)

Let’s go all Ron Jaworski/Merrill Hoge and break this down.

THE PLAYOFF RECORD ARGUMENT:

Eli has the better playoff winning percentage, .667 to .474. That much is true. Peyton, however, has appeared in ten more playoff games, and went to the playoffs eleven times in fourteen years. Eli has managed that feat four times in seven years. The six playoff wins of Eli’s career have come in two total seasons, 2007 and 2011. Peyton won at least one game in four seasons. For mathematically uninclined, that’s twice as many.

In 2007, the season Eli won sixty-seven percent of his career playoff games, the Giants offense scored a grand total of ten touchdowns in four games. As a team. Tom Brady against the Broncos, threw six touchdown passes in one game. And, while Eli won The Joe Montana Trophy (copyright 2012 – me), he threw for a grand total of two-hundred-fifty-five yards, completing fifty-five percent of his passes, which sounds very much like a Joe Flaaco performance. And that was not-so arguably his BEST game of those playoffs. To say that Eli won that Super Bowl in ’07 would be like saying Elijah Wood won Best Picture for ‘Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King’. Sure, he was an important cog in the machine, but replace Peter Jackson with Michael Bay and Ian McKellen with Al Pacino (has an actor ever had a bigger decline?) and the only nomination the film is looking at is a Razzie. (if they’re lucky) The Giants defense held the Patriots – who set the single-season scoring record, and had a QB and receiver who broke NFL records for touchdowns – to fourteen points. Of course it was Eli’s lucky pass and two touchdowns that won that one.

Of course, in 2006, when Peyton won his Super Bowl, he threw a grand total of three touchdown passes in four games, a number that even pre-2011 Eli would scoff at. But, he also threw for three-hundred-forty-six while overcoming a twenty-one point deficit in the AFC Championship game against the Patriots (while his defense held the team to a paltry thirty-four points) and led his team to a twenty-six point per game average while little brother managed only twenty-one a game. But, Eli’s win percentage is better, so there. (add raspberry here.)

THE BETTER OPPONENT ARGUMENT:

In 2007, Eli and the Giants run to the Lombardi Trophy included toppling Tony Romo (in the year he threw thirty-six touchdown passes), Brett Favre, and Tom Brady. In 2011, he’s added Favre’s successor, Aaron Rogers to those he’s vanquished. Peyton, on the other hand, has beaten Brady and no one else. Seriously. Here is the complete list of QBs that have lost playoff games to Peyton Manning: Jake Plummer (2), Trent Green (2), Steve McNair (the Raven years), Rex Grossman, Joe Flaaco, and Mark Sanchez. You would think I couldn’t argue this point.

But I can. With stats and logic, of all ludicrous means. Here are some numbers:

17.75.

31.86.

The first number represents the average points per game scored in playoff games against the Giants by the ’07 Cowboys, ’07 Packers, ’07 Patriots, ’11 Packers. The second number represents the average points per game for those same four teams throughout the season. That’s a TWO TOUCHDOWN difference. In ’07, the Giants upended three of the top four offenses in the game and in ’11 they’ve taken out the top offense. Meanwhile, the G-Men averaged 24.50 points per game in those four playoff games. If those teams (and their hallowed QBs) had played to their regular season potential, the G-Men would’ve lost three of the four games, only beating the ’11 Packers by two. Considering Eli runs the offense and, presumably, contributes zero to the defense, isn’t it rational, then, to say that the impressive victories over elite QBs were less to do with Eli’s greatness as a quarterback, and more to do with the Giants defense being utterly badass in both ’07 and ’11? To boot, the 2011 Eli-led offense scored only twenty-four against a mediocre-at-best Falcons D, winning one-hundred-ninety-two percent on the backs of the defense, who allowed ZERO points.

For the record, in his one victory over Brady, Peyton brought the Colts back from twenty-one down, throwing for three-hundred-forty-nine yards and lighting up the scoreboard with thirty-eight points. Also, of note, Peyton doesn’t play defense, and, therefore neither assists or disables that unit. Just in case there were any misconceptions.

THE ROAD WARRIOR ARGUMENT:

Eli has won four road playoff games, Peyton, two. Mark Sanchez has also won four road playoff games and Steve Young never did. Can we agree this argument is now officially moot? Good. Let’s move on.

THE FOUR-THOUSAND-NINE-HUNDRED-THIRTY-THREE ARGUMENT:

Matthew Stafford passed for more yards in 2011 than all but four quarterbacks in the history of the NFL. Soak that in. Matt Stafford. Two of the four who threw for more – Drew Brees and Brady – did it in 2011 as well. Three of the five top passing yardage seasons of all time occurred this year, the same year Eli threw for four-thousand-nine-hundred-thirty-three. With all that yardage, Eli managed twenty-nine touchdowns, which was tied for sixth with he-of-the-most-ironic-nickname- in-the-NFL, “Matty Ice” Ryan. Eli was seventh in QB Rating (but that stat reeks a bit of bullshit when you consider Brian Griese and Chad Pennington led the league at one point) and he was honored as an All-Pro over Stafford (who also threw forty-one touchdowns) for reasons I can only fathom having something to do with a hatred of Detroit, or the Lions, or both. Probably both.

Big brother Peyton led the league in passing yardage on two separate occasions (2000, 2003), led in touchdowns three times, (once setting the NFL record with forty-nine) QB rating three more times, was named to the Pro-Bowl eleven times, five times as a first-teamer, and, oh yeah, has been the most valuable player of the National Football League four fucking times, one for each of Eli’s road playoff wins.

But, his career high is only 4,700, not 4,933.

THE FOURTH QUARTER TOUCHDOWN BARRAGE:

Can’t argue this stat. Eli threw more fourth quarter touchdown passes than any QB ever, notching fifteen of them. Impressive, little brother. Impressive. (no sarcasm intended) Who’s record did he break? That’s right, big brother’s. Hey, it may only be one TD, but it’s still a victory.

But, what does it mean when a QB is throwing a ton of fourth quarter touchdown passes? That the team is regularly behind, right? Which would indicate that said quarterback wasn’t being overly effective during the first three quarters. Proof? Eli threw more touchdowns in the fourth quarter in 2011 than he did in the first three quarters combined. (15 to 14) And, the G-Men were 9-7 this year. Nine wins + throwing a lot in the fourth quarter = not as great a QB as you may think.

THE WHAT IF ARGUMENT (not Reilly’s):

If the Giants are to win the Super Bowl again this season (and, it’s entirely possible) with Eli putting up Brady-like numbers (better than Peyton’s) then, of course, the pundits will act like paparazzi seeing Lindsay Lohan exit a car with a micro-mini dress – and nothing else - on, they’ll start frothing at the mouth, giggling uncontrollably like Beavis staring through a Hooters window, they’ll pound on their keyboards and many of them, desperate for that mouse click that quantifies their position, and boldly state ‘Eli Manning – Football’s Favorite Son’.

And, yes, that would officially put him ahead of Peyton in the rings column, with many years left to play. However, stating that winning two Super Bowls is rare among NFL quarterbacks would be as accurate as the GOP claiming the Keystone pipeline will add “tens of thousands of jobs.” The list of QBs that have accomplished this feat is neither short nor necessarily elite. Nine QBs have at least two rings, accounting for twenty-three of the forty-five Super Bowl victories. (51%) On one hand you have Bart Starr, Joe Montana, Troy Aikman, John Elway, and Tom Brady. On the other hand, you have Bob Greise, Terry Bradshaw, Roger Staubach, and Ben Roethlisberger. While the top four are arguably among the top ten all-time, the bottom four, while very good, certainly are not. Is Peyton Manning a top ten QB? Even with only one ring? What about Favre or Marino or Brees or Unitas? While Super Bowl victories are an indication of a quarterback’s historical standing, it certainly is not the most important measuring stick, right Dan?

Hey Dan, Eli could have two more
Super Bowl trophies than you. So, he's
better, right?

Even I, as a card-carrying member of the Eli Sucks movement, can admit that he has grown into a fine and accomplished quarterback, even saying that, right now, he’s top five playing. But, a year ago, Philip Rivers could have been considered a top five. Same with Michael Vick. And, Matthew Stafford certainly looks like a guy who could be there.

Peyton Manning was (and could possibly still be, if he returns) the best for most of the years he played and no worse than the second best at any other time. When his bronze bust comes to rest in Canton, many will consider him as the best there ever was, and every sane person will put him in the top five.

Peyton’s teams went 141-67 (.679) when he played. The year he didn’t, the Colts had the worst record in the NFL. The G-Men, with Eli at the helm, are 69-50 (.580). They were 38-35 (.521) in the seventy-three games before him, starting the likes of Kerry Collins (0-4 in Indy post-Peyton) and a then-scared-to-death-of-getting-hit Kurt Warner. Eli’s Giants have won ten or more games in a season four times in seven years. Peyton’s Colts did it eleven of his thirteen seasons, eight times winning twelve or more, a feat Eli has accomplished exactly once. And, again, did you see the Colts this year without Peyton? Do you think the Giants win less than two games if Eli is replaced with Dan Orlovsky?

Peyton’s career numbers are vastly superior, he has four more MVP awards and was never worse than the second best QB in the game during his tenure. His team was a consistent winner for over a decade, and completely fell apart when he left. He is better statistic wise, and team importance wise.

To say Eli could be better at this point holds about as much water as the levees in New Orleans during Katrina. It’s just ridiculous. Hey, Ryan Braun mashed the ball for the Brewers in 2011, is he the second coming of Barry Bonds? Other than making up excuses for alleged PED use, that is.

Can we cool our jets on this talk? Take a step back and watch tapes of Peyton circa 2004, then re-watch Eli’s 2011. Perhaps then guys like Rick Reilly can step back from the universe of Show Me cards, twenty-four-hour-a-day Bluetooth headsets, and Secretary of the Defense Walter Bishop, and come back to our world, where Eli Manning can’t hold a used-forty-two-times birthday candle to his big brother. Not yet. Not even close.